Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
cheapivecoparts.co.uk

These forums are free and rely upon the goodwill of members to help and assist others. Any donations will be gratefully received.

You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use.

Join our community!

If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
question for you guys with the new daily 4x4
Topic Started: Sep 12 2013, 10:25 PM (2,844 Views)
Ned
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
Hey all

im after buying a bremach with the same tubeless split rims, that i think you guys have.

were you supplied with any literature on how to use them? I tried to inflate one the other day and got nowhere.

my uncle owns a tyre place, he used a custom gas drum device, he pressurises it with compressed air and then basically explodes it inside a large tyre, to get the initial seal. its not needed on car tyres, but it is on tractor and plant tyres.
The device is the same used in the following vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BiRdKg5ajs

i cant see this as being practical for offroad use however, so there must be a better way?

I can find very little on the subject online
you can see it done beautifully here, diy style with fire

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqIBhSJI3og

but, this is a proper tubeless rim, with a wheel well.
the tubeless split rim doesnt have a wheel well, and therefore there is no space to squirt gas, into the tyre interior
Edited by Ned, Sep 12 2013, 10:45 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
marcustuck
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
Ned
Sep 12 2013, 10:25 PM
Hey all

im after buying a bremach with the same tubeless split rims, that i think you guys have.

were you supplied with any literature on how to use them? I tried to inflate one the other day and got nowhere.

my uncle owns a tyre place, he used a custom gas drum device, he pressurises it with compressed air and then basically explodes it inside a large tyre, to get the initial seal. its not needed on car tyres, but it is on tractor and plant tyres.
The device is the same used in the following vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BiRdKg5ajs

i cant see this as being practical for offroad use however, so there must be a better way?

I can find very little on the subject online
you can see it done beautifully here, diy style with fire

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqIBhSJI3og

but, this is a proper tubeless rim, with a wheel well.
the tubeless split rim doesnt have a wheel well, and therefore there is no space to squirt gas, into the tyre interior
I have heard that this is a problem but I've not tried it on mine yet. I have heard that you can use a 16" bicycle inner-tube to form a seal between the tyre and rim while initially inflating the tyre! Another technique is to use a ratchet strap around the middle of the tyre and ratcheting it tight, this apparently pushes the side walls out a bit, again I have not tried this either yet.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ned
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
interesting suggestions

the problem I'm having is that when i search for it im getting results for tubed or tubeless rims, not these, which are a hybrid.

I might email Bremach on the matter, or maybe ask the guys over on http://forum.bernard.debucquoi.com/ as they might have seen them before
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
marcustuck
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
I will be interested in what you find, there is nothing in the vehicle handbook or workshop manuals for these wheels!
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Goingbush
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
With Landrover tubeless rims I pop the beads on with butane and a bbq lighter (long handle) you don't need much gas and it dosen't have to go "inside" the wheel well, just squirt a little in the gap thats not sealing, stand back and light it,
Tip - take the valve out, otherwise as the air cools down after the fire it could suck the bead off again, leave the valve out & it sucks air in as it cools. Ive tried ratchet strap around the tyre circumfrence and the bike tube sealing ring, might be ok with a workshop compressor but wont work in the desert with a 12v compressor.

I cant see why same method would not work with any tubeless tyre / rim combination.

ps be bloody careful with split rims , don't want the ring flying off and decapitating anyone, turn the wheel upsideown so the ring is facing the floor and put the gas in the back of the wheel.

Edited by Goingbush, Sep 14 2013, 09:32 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ned
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
I went at it today. i fitted a 900 R16 XZL, th earlier version of the 255/100's. It was so easy!
i think the problem i ran into with it last week was that i was tyring to fit a smaller, thinner tyre, a 31 inch.

the width of the xzl made it press firmly against the walls and the rubber sealing ring. It inflated no problem. I'm thinking they are in fact, pretty cool.
Edited by Ned, Sep 15 2013, 10:42 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
mark hadley
No Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
Fascinating. is it true that these wheels have an o-ring seal. If so where do you get them from. Are you saying that they inflate with a 12V compressor? I presuem that is the idea of them - field repairs but no inner tube to let you down.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
marcustuck
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
Hi Mark,

Yes they have a seal so can be used tubulesly but it gets even better, the valve can be removed and you can also use them with tubes if needed (the XZL can be used with and without tubes). These wheels really give you the best of both worlds. I have not found a part number for the sealing rings yet though, does anyone have it?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
mark hadley
No Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
marcustuck
Sep 20 2013, 03:40 AM
Hi Mark,

Yes they have a seal so can be used tubulesly but it gets even better, the valve can be removed and you can also use them with tubes if needed (the XZL can be used with and without tubes). These wheels really give you the best of both worlds. I have not found a part number for the sealing rings yet though, does anyone have it?
I don't think it will have an Iveco part number, I think it is like the tyre and valve - they are provide by the tyre people - Michelin etc. I have seen the beads for sale for larger wheels (earth movers I think) but not for 16 inch rims.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ned
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
i got a new second hand xzl from mt uncle, he ownes a tyre business. He gave me a sealing with it.

the xzl was pulled of a renault B120 4x4, which also use a tubeless split ring setup.

however, the rubber sealing ring that came off the renault was bigger than the sealing ring that came off the bremach (the bremach rims look to be the same rims that are on the new daily, scam etc.)

I asked him were they expensive, he said the rings cost about 30 euros or so, thats to him, in the trade, to the customer probably more.

I have the old sealing ring somewhere. ill have a look at it and see if there is a brand and a part number on it. the one that came of my rim was a bit perished.

however (always a caveat) with my rim, the 255/100 xlz exploded a few years ago, and it sat like that for a few years, which would explain the perishing.
also, the exploded xzl was very difficult to remove from the rim, because ithe bead had stuck to the back wall of the rim. i had to use a jack to force it away and it took about 40 mins. fighting with rubber is a crap game, i must say.

that was my initial impression of tubeless split rims, - a bad impression.

however, when i got the new (secondhand) xzl, i couldnt believe how easy it was to put on and inflate.

i gotta say i was very impressed, amazed even. i had been expecting another fight. there was none, it went on like butter.

Yah Mark, normal 220v compressor, no problems. I need to get myself a decent 12v one.
Edited by Ned, Sep 27 2013, 07:11 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
mark hadley
No Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
I bought this from ebay as a compressor. I'm pleased with it so far. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Portable-Air-Compressor-4x4-Off-Road-Expedition-Quality-Pump-Car-Tyre-Inflator-/290770574337?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item43b346dc01

Did you see my link on the Iveco 4x4 forum to the Bremach site and the part numbers for the sealing rings.
>>>>
A tubeless split rim wheel assembly 90C5014 624 Euros
The Rubber sea; 91C5002 12.10 Euro including VAT

Neither are in stock, availability is supposed to be 2 to 3 days

See
http://www.bremach.it/catalogo-ricambi/gruppo30.pdf
the last two pages give a wheel and a variety of part numbers.
>>>>>>>>>>

Are these seals just big o-rings? If so then all you need is the size because they can be made up from reels of rubber/ nitrile and glued. It is a standard procedure at work for specialist sizes.
Edited by mark hadley, Sep 27 2013, 11:20 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ned
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
no not just o rings, they are shaped to meet the bead of the tyre and seal against it. i couldnt find a pic online, and i seem to have misplaced my spare one, so i made this to illustrate what they look like if you sliced them and looked at them in profile


Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
marcustuck
Member Avatar
Member
[ *  * ]
Hi Mark,

If you are thinking of placing an order for some I would happy buy a few of the sealing rings from you.

Regards,

Marcus
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
« Previous Topic · 4x4 Specialist Vehicles/Expedition/Overlanders · Next Topic »
Add Reply

These forums are free and rely upon the goodwill of members to help and assist others. Any donations will be gratefully received.